Hello from a 80's C'dale Employee

roddesu

Member
Hello everyone,

My name is Rod Holmes, my wife is Laura, and if you've closely examined the early 90's Cannondale catalogs, ('91, '92 & '93) you may know of us as the Mobile Holmes. Here are some screenshots I lifted from those scanned catalogs.

laura.png
rod.png




We both grew up in South Dakota where we met in college, where I studied math and computer science education and Laura studied journalism. I also worked as a bicycle mechanic during college. When I received a letter from Boeing retracting their offer to hire me as a computer engineer due to a strike, I had to figure out what I'd do after graduation. I had bought a Cannondale touring bike with my bike shop employee discount and loved it, but it had a creak in the bottom bracket that would not go away. I called Cannondale as a consumer (not mentioning I worked at a bike shop) and they shipped me out a replacement frame. As I was trying to figure out where to work, I remembered how well C'dale had treated me, and decided to give them a call.

My call was routed to Joan in HR. I asked if they were hiring and Joan said, "YES!! You're hired! When can you start? What do you know how to do? Where do you live?" They clearly needed people. I said I was a mechanic and knew a lot about computers (not all that common in 1985) and that I lived in SD. She paused a long time and then asked if I realized the job was in CT. I said I did and was very interested in relocating. (#1 export from SD is educated young people!) I agreed to fly out (People Express to the rescue of a broke college kid!). I flew to Providence RI, had an interview with Rhode Gear (which was pretty unimpressive), and then drove to Georgetown, CT where I immediately fell in love with the area, the offices, and the culture of C'dale. Laura and I took the plunge and agreed to move.

I started, as everyone did in 1985, in customer service. I worked the phones for about a week until Graham in R&D realized I was a mechanic and pulled me back into the shop. I worked for about 9 months on spec'ing bikes (working with the team deciding how many links of chain were needed for a SunTour derailleur with a particular freewheel, how tall the steering tube needed to be on each size of a particular model, etc.) and running the testing program: making sure new bikes, components, and clothing got into the hands of the employees who went out at lunch on long training rides, and we got feedback. I also got to spend many mornings going on 20 to 30 mile rides, testing one thing or another. I know...tough job. Then Ron in purchasing showed up at my desk, said he was returning to VT, and said he'd told Joe Montgomery (C'dale's owner) that I should be his replacement in purchasing. Ron was responsible for buying everything that made the bike frames: tubing, extrusions, decals, and cable guides were the main responsibility. I loved that job and my boss (Scott Montgomery) was fantastic. I did a bit too well at purchasing. When Barry, the director of accounting, decided to leave, Joe asked me to replace him. I was 100% UNqualified to do the job, but begrudgingly agreed, leaving perhaps best job I've ever had in my life. That began the worst year of my work life and the job I've hated the most. I was working 60 to 80 hours per week trying to keep my head above water and felt like I was drowning every damn day.

On my first day of work, Joan commented that she saw I was married. She asked if Laura would be interested in a job. Laura started shortly after that in accounting. She was the only person at C'dale at the time that I knew of who didn't start in customer service. At first she was in AR, and then her last year she was in AP. She was not trained in either, but her fastidious nature made it a perfect fit and she excelled.

<continued below>
 

roddesu

Member
When Laura and I met at SDSU and were dating, we bonded over the deep desire to see the world. She wanted to hitchhike around the world (a holdover from her days working in Yellowstone and hitchhiking all over the area on days off) and I wanted to bike. She agreed my plan was much more sane. We set biking around the world as a long-term goal with no way of achieving it. Laura really hadn't ever ridden a bike more than a mile or two at this point. We figured when we started at C'dale it was definitely a step in the right direction. While we were at C'dale, Laura gifted me the book, Pedaling the Ends of the Earth by David Duncan about four guys riding bikes around the world. We both devoured it and both quickly realized that Duncan had done 99% of everything related to his trip totally wrong. He had obviously had a horrible experience, and was trying to make it sound like only a super human could do what he'd done. It was truly a manual in what NOT to do when riding around the world. Laura then found Miles from Nowhere by Barbara Savage. It was the opposite of "Ends of the Earth." It was an absolutely delicious book that I stayed up all night reading. Barbara and her husband were people who knew how to travel and were proof that normal people could do this. It solidified our goal and we started doing nothing but working and saving money.

The whole time we were planning and thinking about a world tour, my college roommate and the best man in our wedding, Mike, was part of our plan. He was going with us on this open-ended trip. I felt we'd be safer if we had two males on the trip.

At C'dale, I started spending some time figuring out the bikes and gear we'd need. I had decided we were going to use a rare frame that C'dale didn't make many of. It was called the Cul de Sac. [EDIT: Apparently it's real model name is a "Town and Country."] It was a "city mountain bike" that had touring bike geometry, a horizontal top tube, and 26" wheels. I was calling in all my favors from Jim at the factory in Bedford and from the team in R&D at Georgetown trying to locate an 18" for Laura, a 20" for me, and a 22" for 6' 4" Mike. Miracle of miracles, we found them! I started collecting demos of high end components found laying around C'dale (if you knew where to look). We built our own wheels, got Michelin to give us a bunch of folding-bead 26" road-focused tires, found friction bar end shifters, and on and on and on.

The list of what we needed never seemed to get shorter. I found a complete 5-bag-set of green panniers for Laura and two full 5-bag sets of blue panniers for Mike and I. (We still have the bags and they are in great shape.) We were able to get ahold of some of the very last C'dale's last sleeping bags. C'dale made an amazing cycling/sneaker shoe one year and I got us those...We had a C'dale tent, but decided against taking it because it wasn't free standing. C'dale and another new'ish company called Patagonia had a reciprocal deal where each others employees got employee discounts at the other company, so we ordered this new thing called a fleece jacket and thin long underwear from them. And on and on and on.

In early 1989 we walked into our boss's office and said we'd be leaving in 2 months. In April we moved all our stuff back to SD and met up with Mike who had also packed up his apartment in Seattle and moved everything back to SD. In May we took off on a journey that changed our lives and still impacts every day of my life. There are endless stories that can be told about the trip, but in late 1990 we'd made our way to Northern Thailand. Laura and I were running out of money. Mike still had a bit. Laura and I decided to move to Tokyo where we'd heard you could make a ton of money teaching English. We wanted to restuff our bank account so we could continue with the trip. Mike continued on with the goal of reaching SD. Laura and I ended up living in Tokyo for 1.5 years, then hitting the road again for about a year of bike touring before returning to the States for more education. Once we had the right degrees we returned to Tokyo for another eight years. Mike met his to-be wife while he was making his way back to SD, which the two of them did together.

Laura and I still have and ride our Cul de Sac's. I've upgraded both of them once. Also, C'dale gave us a first-gen tandem in exchange for the photos you see in the catalogs. We rode that tandem around Japan a lot, even though tandems were illegal in the country. (We got pulled over only once and told to take the bike home and not use it again.) While in Tokyo, we planned on an third long trip: overland from Korea to London by tandem. We sold the C'dale tandem and bought a custom steel tandem by a small builder in Philly. But then...our two kids arrived in short succession and we instead settled into domestic life in Tokyo, and then eventually moving to Chicago where we are now.

I was invited to join this forum by one of the prolific members. He found us through Warm Showers and suggested I might be able to answer some questions from people. I doubt I'll have many answers, but we'll see. I can definitely answer many questions about what was going on at the company in Georgetown and Bedford from 1985 to 1989 if anyone is interested. I know a lot about how the frames were made and the ins/outs of the factory at that time.
 
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letsbike

Well-Known Member
WELCOME!!!

It would be really great if you posted some pictures of those world traveling bikes as they look today, and put them up in the Gallery. That is where people will go to search for various specific models. I am still trying to figure your bikes out. The 26" wheels and drop bars are an exotic combination for Cannondale. Could you maybe find something in a Cannondale catalog that they were built up from? I am thinking that the frames hark back to the 1985 Town and Country pictured below.

I'm so glad you are on board.
 

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kjop

Well-Known Member
a lot to read, but great story! looking forward to read also some insides from back then in future. and maybe get to know the one or other intention by cannondale. welcome! :) are you still connected to cannondale-buddies from that time?
 

roddesu

Member
It would be really great if you posted some pictures of those world traveling bikes as they look today, and put them up in the Gallery. That is where people will go to search for various specific models. I am still trying to figure your bikes out. The 26" wheels and drop bars are an exotic combination for Cannondale. Could you maybe find something in a Cannondale catalog that they were built up from? I am thinking that the frames hark back to the 1985 Town and Country pictured below.
You found it. I'm not sure if "Cul de Sac" was an internal C'dale name or not, but now that you say "Town and Country" I remember that name as well. As you can see in your picture, the frame has a touring bike's quite long chain stays and a long wheel base. You can't see with the eye, but its head tube angle and rake are also exactly the same as a touring bike.

The only piece of the bike in the picture I used was the frame, and I even took them to the factory and had them repainted because I hated the light blue in the picture. The day I took them (via the company plane which went weekly), they were painting a few colors, and I chose dark blue. I took that frame and built up high-end touring bikes on top of it. I found top-of-the-line mountain bike forks and had the R&D shop guys braze into them low rider mounts. I was able to use all the stuff laying around C'dale's offices and R&D shop to locate mt. bike stems that gave each bike basically a custom fit for Laura, Mike and I. I was able to find wide drop bars that worked with mt. bike stems. In the days before the internet, it would have been quite difficult to build what I did without the resources of C'dale.
 

roddesu

Member
P.S. - I thought the part about tandems being illegel in Japan was funny. My wife and I were once ordered off a road and onto a broken sidewalk, by a policeman, while riding our tandem in Ohio. I was fuming, but I bit my tongue, and quickly exited that city.
The law in Japan is two people cannot ride one bicycle...and of course it doesn't matter that the bicycle was expressly built to safely carry two people! Our good friends in Tokyo had a pink tandem recumbent they rode all over Tokyo and were never stopped.
 

roddesu

Member
a lot to read, but great story! looking forward to read also some insides from back then in future. and maybe get to know the one or other intention by cannondale. welcome! :) are you still connected to cannondale-buddies from that time?
I am connected with several of them via LinkedIn. If I see a question one of them may be able to answer, I'll use the opportunity to try to get them to join.

And sorry about the length—I tend to be pretty verbose. I like telling stories though and to me, it's hard to explain how our bikes came to be without going into quite a bit of detail!
 

letsbike

Well-Known Member
I personally love the detail, don't stop, or apologize. Recently people have been discussing the existence of a Cannondale 50th anniversary book that was not sold, but was given away to select people. Everyone would like to browse that book, but nobody wants to buy it. You are our human resource to what may lie on those pages. Have you ever seen a book with one sentence chapters?
 

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roddesu

Member
Hmmm...most of the people I'm friendly with would not have been on the list.

Could take up a collection and just buy it. It's not all that expensive if it's still for sale.
 

letsbike

Well-Known Member
That Town and Country bicycle was posted by a new member back in May. He found it in perfect condition lying with some cheapo bikes in a ten dollar bargain bin. I hope that he still comes on the site and sees that the pedigree of his bicycle has been elevated to world traveler.
You said that the third bike, owned by Mike, was stolen in Vancouver. Was that Washington State, or Canada? I'd love to see it show up. It might be easy to identify, seeing as though only three exist.
 

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letsbike

Well-Known Member
Hmmm...most of the people I'm friendly with would not have been on the list.

Could take up a collection and just buy it. It's not all that expensive if it's still for sale.
Most of the copies are in Europe. Key word is "most."
 

roddesu

Member
That Town and Country bicycle was posted by a new member back in May. He found it in perfect condition lying with some cheapo bikes in a ten dollar bargain bin. I hope that he still comes on the site and sees that the pedigree of his bicycle has been elevated to world traveler.
You said that the third bike, owned by your friend, was stolen in Vancouver. Was that Washington State, or Canada? I'd love to see it show up. It might be easy to identify, seeing as though only three exist.

Mike married the woman he met, and rode back to SD with, after we split up in Bankok. She was from Vancouver, Canada and they have lived in BC ever since. His bike was stolen out of his locked garage about 5 years ago. He was devastated and still talks about how much it hurts to have lost that bike. Laura and my bikes are dark blue, but Mike's 22" was teal. I must have taken it with me to Bedford on a different day and teal was the closest color being painted that day. In the 1991 catalog, you can see his bike on page 54 and mine on page 55. Don't know where Laura's bike was parked. The other guy in the hut in that 2-page picture is a Swede named Anders. We came across him in Tamil Nadu, India. He was 6' 6" and riding an Indian hunk-o-junk 1-speed bike with small metal panniers and his backpack strapped across them on the back. We traveled with him for about two months. He rode in flip flops the entire time.
 
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IdahoBrett

Well-Known Member
There is a youtube video from inside the factory from the early 2000’s and the host was a C’dale employee. I tracked him down on linkedin and asked him to join us over here, but never received a response. He was there during ‘04-‘07 so you probably didn’t know him. His name is Andy S. Not sure I should post his full name. He may not care to have it here. Ring a bell?

I could envision your own sub forum here. I would simply call it “Ask Rod”.

Any knowledge about the Black Lightning bike model? Like how it came to fruition and why. Thanks.
 

Nico

Well-Known Member
Welcome Rod
Thanks for the sharing your experience when working at C'dale.
Looks like the dynamics in C'dales CT office differs a lot from the atmosphere I experiences when working for C'dale as a temp worker in Oldenzaal the Netherlands.
 

roddesu

Member
There is a youtube video from inside the factory from the early 2000’s and the host was a C’dale employee. I tracked him down on linkedin and asked him to join us over here, but never received a response. He was there during ‘04-‘07 so you probably didn’t know him. His name is Andy S. Not sure I should post his full name. He may not care to have it here. Ring a bell?

I could envision your own sub forum here. I would simply call it “Ask Rod”.

Any knowledge about the Black Lightning bike model? Like how it came to fruition and why. Thanks.
Hey ID Brett,

Nope, I don't know anyone from the early 2000s...only the 80s and if they stayed through the 2000s. Most who stayed that long were in sales. By the 2000s I was living in Tokyo and had two kids and two companies that had nothing to do with bicycles (unfortunately).

I believe the Black Lightening came about because SunTour came to C'dale with the black and gold Sprint groupo. I don't think C'dale asked SunTour...I think it was the other way around. HOWEVER, I do know the guy who designed it and would know. I'll ask him. My only connection to the first years of the Black Lightening is I ordered the water transfer gold stickers.

As for "Ask Rod" I just don't think I know enough to be of much use. And what I know is very specific to 1985 to 1989. I suspect it'd be a lot of "I don't know" and "I'm not sure" and "That happened after I was there."

I have thought of a post that I will write up that I think is important for this group about where 80's C'dale can fail and that should be watched. I check it every time I get on my bike. I have a life-long distrust and dislike of all things Shimano due to my work at C'dale and how they acted after they locked down indexed shifting after their broad patent was granted. I might write about that. I have some good stories about flying with Joe back/forth from CT to Bedford. We'll see. I have two companies (Pilot & Pasq - Pasq may have been inspired by the Cannondale Bugger) now which take up way too much of my time. But...reminiscing about the past is fun!
 

roddesu

Member
Welcome Rod
Thanks for the sharing your experience when working at C'dale.
Looks like the dynamics in C'dales CT office differs a lot from the atmosphere I experiences when working for C'dale as a temp worker in Oldenzaal the Netherlands.
Hey Nico,

The culture at the Georgetown offices in the 80s was pretty amazing. Sales had it's own culture, driven mainly by Ted K, Danno, and Joe. Sales was in the "modern" building filled with cubicles and people on the phone nonstop. It was kind of a generic building and where reception was. Sales was dominated by racers/racer wannabes and was highly competitive. The rest of the company was very young, very underpaid, and very dedicated. Scott Montgomery was the driving force in the manufacturing side of things, which was housed in an old barn that had been connected to the "modern" building. David Graham (the college kid who pitched the idea of aluminum bikes to Joe) drove engineering and design. David was very intense, which meant the shop, R&D, and design were also kind of intense. Engineering lived in what I'd describe as a shed added on to the back of the "modern" building. It's also where the weight room was, which was really important to a few people. On the whole, it was a healthy—but overworked—environment where most people ran around in shorts, jeans in the winter, t-shirts, lots of bare feet, and cycling gear.

One fun piece of the culture...on your anniversary day with the company you were supposed to wear what you wore to your interview. The assumption was you over-dressed for the interview and would look like an idiot walking around in a suit for a day. Danno (head of sales) came in every year in the ugliest red suit I've ever seen.

A favorite story of mine about the culture is when the Alcan (huge, huge aluminum company) sales dude showed up to talk with the new buyer (me) and try to win our business. He was probably in his 60's and weighed about 300 lbs...I was 23. He showed up in an enormous Cadillac and a Brooks Brother's suit. I met him at reception in flip flops, shorts and a t-shirt. He looked confused. I took him to my desk (not an office) in a barn and started showing him Lotus 123 spreadsheets, which I don't think he'd ever seen before. He was confused. He was there to wine and dine me and I was barely of drinking age. He took me to lunch in a little pub (the only thing around) where he had two martinis and I had a Coke. He was confused why I wasn't joining him in some gin at lunch. When we got back he asked to talk with Scott, my boss. Scott had just returned from the weight room and was dripping in sweat. He was maybe 25. Scott shook Alcan-dude's hand and said Alcan had to talk with me. Alcan-dude looked nervously at me, the kid standing next to him. We went back to my desk (still no office and still in the barn) and he asked if he could meet Joe. I called Joe, explained, and he said to bring Alcan-dude in. Joe had just come back from a run and was sweaty, bare footed, and wearing only his usual tiny, flimsy running shorts. Alcan-dude looked very confused, but started to pitch Joe. Joe stopped him mid-sentence and said to talk to me. Alcan-dude slunk back to my desk with me, looking sheepish. He tried to understand my projection spreadsheets, but clearly didn't understand what he was looking at, and drove away dejected in his big ass Caddy. Alcan didn't get the business.

It sounds like the Dutch side of things were a bit different?
 
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Flat tyre bikes

Active Member
Hey Nico,

The culture at the Georgetown offices in the 80s was pretty amazing. Sales had it's own culture, driven mainly by Ted K, Danno, and Joe. Sales was in the "modern" building filled with cubicles and people on the phone nonstop. It was kind of a generic building and where reception was. Sales was dominated by racers/racer wannabes and was highly competitive. The rest of the company was very young, very underpaid, and very dedicated. Scott Montgomery was the driving force in the manufacturing side of things, which was housed in an old barn that had been connected to the "modern" building. David Graham (the college kid who pitched the idea of aluminum bikes to Joe) drove engineering and design. David was very intense, which meant the shop, R&D, and design were also kind of intense. Engineering lived in what I'd describe as a shed added on to the back of the "modern" building. It's also where the weight room was, which was really important to a few people. On the whole, it was a healthy—but overworked—environment where most people ran around in shorts, jeans in the winter, t-shirts, lots of bare feet, and cycling gear.

One fun piece of the culture...on your anniversary day with the company you were supposed to wear what you wore to your interview. The assumption was you over-dressed for the interview and would look like an idiot walking around in a suit for a day. Danno (head of sales) came in every year in the ugliest red suit I've ever seen.

A favorite story of mine about the culture is when the Alcan (huge, huge aluminum company) sales dude showed up to talk with the new buyer (me) and try to win our business. He was probably in his 60's and weighed about 300 lbs...I was 23. He showed up in an enormous Cadillac and a Brooks Brother's suit. I met him at reception in flip flops, shorts and a t-shirt. He looked confused. I took him to my desk (not an office) in a barn and started showing him Lotus 123 spreadsheets, which I don't think he'd ever seen before. He was confused. He was there to wine and dine me and I was barely of drinking age. He took me to lunch in a little pub (the only thing around) where he had two martinis and I had a Coke. He was confused why I wasn't joining him in some gin at lunch. When we got back he asked to talk with Scott, my boss. Scott had just returned from the weight room and was dripping in sweat. He was maybe 25. Scott shook Alcan-dude's hand and said Alcan had to talk with me. Alcan-dude looked nervously at me, the kid standing next to him. We went back to my desk (still no office and still in the barn) and he asked if he could meet Joe. I called Joe, explained, and he said to bring Alcan-dude in. Joe had just come back from a run and was sweaty, bare footed, and wearing only his usual tiny, flimsy running shorts. Alcan-dude looked very confused, but started to pitch Joe. Joe stopped him mid-sentence and said to talk to me. Alcan-dude slunk back to my desk with me, looking sheepish. He tried to understand my projection spreadsheets, but clearly didn't understand what he was looking at, and drove away dejected in his big ass Caddy. Alcan didn't get the business.

It sounds like the Dutch side of things were a bit different?
Roddesu, good to have you on the website. I'm fascinated about the early days of Cannondale. This is a great story about meeting the salesman. So where did the aluminum tubes come from? Keep the stories comming! Cheers, Kevin
 
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